REVIEW 2 major objections 4 minor 4 cited by
Joint X-ray, kinetic Sunyaev-Zeldovich, and weak lensing measurements: toward a consensus picture of efficient gas expulsion from groups and clusters
T0 review · 2 major / 4 minor · reviewed 2026-08-15 · deepseek-v4-flash
Pith's one-line read Joint kSZ, X-ray, and galaxy-galaxy lensing measurements show that groups and clusters expel roughly twice as much gas as the fiducial FLAMINGO simulation predicts, with the strongest-feedback variant matching the data and implying ~10%…
desk verdict A strong multi-probe case that feedback depletes gas more than fiducial FLAMINGO, but the 'consensus' headline overreaches the mass range that the data actually support. read the letter →
The pith
A machine-rendered reading of the paper's core claim, the machinery that carries it, and where it could break.
The reading
What carries the argument
The load-bearing mechanism is the GGL-calibrated sample selection: for each observed kSZ stack or X-ray sample, the authors choose simulated galaxies above a minimum stellar mass, or halos above a minimum mass, so that the predicted galaxy-galaxy lensing profile $\Delta\Sigma(R)$ matches the measurement, marginalizing over the observed redshift distribution. This fixes the mean halo mass and satellite fraction, breaking the degeneracy between feedback strength and sample composition. The kSZ prediction then stacks Doppler-$b$ parameter maps through the same compensated aperture filter and Gaussian beam convolution as the observations, while the X-ray comparison uses eROSITA-reported gas masses at the GGL-calibrated halo masses.
What would settle it
Recompute the eROSITA gas fractions using an independent X-ray flux calibration and hydrostatic or lensing mass estimates; if the gas fractions rise to the fiducial FLAMINGO relation, or if the GGL-calibrated halo masses shift by more than roughly $0.4$ dex, the claimed discrepancy would disappear. A complementary check is to apply the exact kSZ velocity-reconstruction pipeline to simulated FLAMINGO skies: if the recovered amplitudes match the fiducial simulation rather than the data, the inferred feedback strength is an artifact of velocity bias.
Extended reading notes
Core claim
The central claim is that gas expulsion beyond $R_{500}$ is much more efficient than most hydrodynamical simulations produce. The authors achieve a like-with-like comparison by selecting simulated FLAMINGO galaxies or halos whose stacked galaxy-galaxy lensing profile reproduces the observed one, fixing the mean halo mass and satellite fraction before comparing gas probes. Under that calibration, the fiducial FLAMINGO simulation overpredicts the kSZ amplitude for all five primary stacks and overpredicts eROSITA gas fractions by roughly a factor of two; the combined kSZ discrepancy is $>8\sigma$. The strongest feedback variant ($f_{\rm gas}-8\sigma$) reproduces the kSZ and X-ray measurements to within about $2\sigma$, simultaneously matching the gas distribution out to several $R_{500}$ across $M_{500}=10^{13}{-}10^{14}\,M_\odot$ and $0<z<1$. The authors take this as indirect evidence that baryon feedback suppresses the matter power spectrum by roughly $10\%$ at $k=1\,h\,\mathrm{Mpc}^{-1}$ relative to a dark-matter-only universe.
Load-bearing premise
The comparison assumes that selecting FLAMINGO galaxies to match the observed galaxy-galaxy lensing profile yields the same mean halo mass and satellite fraction as the real samples, which relies on the simulation's stellar mass-to-halo mass mapping being unbiased.
Editorial extensions
If this is right
- The fiducial FLAMINGO simulation, calibrated to pre-eROSITA gas fractions, overpredicts the hot gas content of groups and clusters and is excluded by the five primary kSZ stacks at $>8\sigma$ combined.
- The strongest-feedback variant ($f_{\rm gas}-8\sigma$) matches both the eROSITA gas fractions and the kSZ profiles to about $2\sigma$, so the data favor more powerful but less frequent AGN outbursts.
- Gas expulsion in this picture extends beyond several $R_{500}$, not just in the core, implying the baryon feedback effect on the matter power spectrum is about $10\%$ at $k=1\,h\,\mathrm{Mpc}^{-1}$.
- The agreement spans $M_{500}=10^{13}$ to $10^{14}\,M_\odot$ and $0<z<1$, so low-redshift clusters and higher-redshift groups are consistent with the same feedback efficiency.
- The two highest-mass DESI LRG bins are omitted from the primary comparison because spectroscopic and photometric kSZ measurements disagree there; both still disfavor the fiducial simulation.
Reading between the lines
- If the inferred $\sim10\%$ suppression at $k=1\,h\,\mathrm{Mpc}^{-1}$ holds, weak-lensing analyses of the nonlinear matter distribution will need stronger baryon-feedback corrections than most current simulation-based models provide.
- Forward-modeling the eROSITA X-ray selection function into FLAMINGO would test whether selection bias contributes to the low gas fractions; if it does, the required feedback strength could weaken.
- Running the same peculiar-velocity reconstruction pipeline on simulated skies, rather than using true velocities, is a direct test of whether the inferred feedback strength is an artifact of velocity-reconstruction bias.
- The spectroscopic-versus-photometric kSZ disagreement at $M_{500}\gtrsim2\times10^{13}\,M_\odot$ could be resolved by an independent measurement of the same luminous red galaxies; whichever survives decides whether even the strongest FLAMINGO variant is sufficient.
Signed reviews
Editorial analysis
A structured set of objections, weighed in public.
Referee Report
Summary. The paper presents a joint analysis of stacked kinetic Sunyaev-Zeldovich (kSZ) profiles from SDSS+ACT and DESI+ACT, eROSITA X-ray gas mass fractions, and new galaxy-galaxy lensing (GGL) measurements for the kSZ and X-ray samples. The authors select simulated FLAMINGO galaxies and halos that reproduce the observed GGL profiles, thereby fixing the mean halo mass and satellite fraction in a like-with-like comparison, and then compare the observed and simulated kSZ and gas fraction profiles across M500 = 10^13-10^14 Msun and z < 1. They find that the fiducial FLAMINGO simulation overpredicts gas content by >8 sigma in kSZ and by roughly a factor of two in eROSITA gas fractions, and that the strongest-feedback FLAMINGO variant (fgas -8sigma) matches the lower-mass kSZ samples and the eROSITA gas fractions, implying about 10% suppression of the matter power spectrum at k = 1 h/Mpc. The fiducial analysis excludes the two highest-mass DESI LRG kSZ bins (M3 and M4) because the spectroscopic and photometric pipelines disagree there; the spectroscopic M3/M4 profiles require even stronger feedback than fgas -8sigma.
Significance. If the result holds, this is a valuable multi-probe constraint: it combines three independent observables, uses GGL to break the mass-feedback degeneracy, and provides a concrete simulation benchmark. The paper's strengths include the detailed systematics checks in Appendices A and B, the independent kSZ versus X-ray evidence, and the transparent discussion of exclusions and limitations. The claimed ~10% power suppression, if correct, has direct implications for weak-lensing cosmology and for the interpretation of upcoming surveys. However, the high-mass kSZ inconsistency and the partial calibration of fgas -8sigma to shifted pre-eROSITA gas fractions mean that the 'consensus' claim in the abstract and conclusions is stronger than the evidence in the fiducial analysis.
major comments (2)
- [Section 5.1, Appendix C, Table 1] The fiducial kSZ comparison excludes the two highest-mass DESI LRG bins, M3 and M4, because the spectroscopic and photometric pipelines disagree there. This exclusion is made after inspecting the data, and it removes exactly the bins where the strongest-feedback model fails: Table 1 reports deviations of 4.34 sigma and 5.81 sigma for the spectroscopic M3 and M4 profiles against fgas -8sigma, while the photometric profiles are consistent with that model. The abstract and Section 7 nonetheless state that fgas -8sigma 'provides a good description' of the gas distribution across M500 = 10^13-10^14 Msun and z < 1. That statement is not supported by the fiducial sample: at the upper end of the quoted range (log M500 approximately 13.4-13.8), the spectroscopic data demand even stronger gas expulsion and the two pipelines are mutually inconsistent. The claimed mass range should be restricted to log M500 less than about 13.3, or the high-mass bins should be presented as an unresolved systematic requiring even stronger feedback, and the combined >8 sigma significance should be reported both with and without the excluded bins.
- [Sections 3, 5.2, and 7] The X-ray agreement is partly calibrated, not an independent confirmation. Section 3 states that the fgas -8sigma variant was produced by calibrating FLAMINGO to gas-fraction relations shifted down by 8 sigma, and Section 5.2 then shows that eROSITA gas fractions agree with that variant. The eROSITA comparison is therefore a consistency check of the calibration shift, not an independent test. The genuinely independent constraints are the kSZ profiles, which were not used in any FLAMINGO calibration, and the GGL mass calibration. The paper does acknowledge this in Sections 6.2 and 7, but the abstract's 'consistent picture' and the statement that joint kSZ, X-ray, and lensing measurements form a consistent picture should be rephrased so that the X-ray agreement is explicitly labeled as partially built-in. Otherwise, readers may overcount the evidence.
minor comments (4)
- [Equation (6)] The notation for the velocity reconstruction bias is inconsistent: the text introduces rv,bias, while Eqs. (6) and (7) use rv,bias and rv; please define these symbols consistently and clarify the relationship between them.
- [Figure 4] The lower-right panel of Figure 4 usefully shades the region M500 greater than about 2e13 Msun where the spectroscopic and photometric measurements disagree; consider adding the same shading to the profile panels in Figures 4 and 8 so that the excluded bins are visually identifiable.
- [Figure 6] The label 'Even Stronger?' in the right panel of Figure 6 is vague; specify that it refers to the spectroscopic M3 and M4 kSZ profiles, which require stronger feedback than fgas -8sigma.
- [Appendix C] The footnote stating that photometric goodness-of-fit uses only diagonal uncertainties is easy to miss; please restate this when quoting photometric sigma values in the main text.
Circularity Check
X-ray agreement with fgas−8σ is partly built into the calibration, while the kSZ comparison provides independent support.
-
fitted input called prediction
[Section 3 (FLAMINGO Simulations) and Section 5.2 (X-ray gas fractions); relied on in the Abstract and Section 7.]
"Variants with stronger (weaker) baryon feedback were produced by calibrating to gas fraction measurements shifted down (up) by Nσ, where σ is the observational uncertainty on the mean gas fraction relation and N∈[2,4,8]. ... The eROSITA gas fractions agree remarkably well with the strongest feedback FLAMINGO simulation."
The fgas−8σ variant is defined by shifting the calibration gas-fraction relation down by 8σ, so the gas fraction is the same quantity used to construct the model. Reporting that eROSITA gas fractions agree with this variant is therefore a calibrated-model selection rather than an out-of-sample prediction: the low gas fractions are partly built into the simulation by construction. The abstract and conclusions fold this agreement into the claim that the strongest feedback model 'provides a good description of how much gas is expelled,' without noting that the X-ray part is a regression to a shifted version of the fitted relation. The kSZ profiles are not part of FLAMINGO's calibration, so the kSZ comparison retains independent content.
full rationale
The paper's derivation chain is mostly self-contained: the GGL matching uses gravity-dominated lensing profiles to set mean halo masses and satellite fractions, and the kSZ predictions from the matched samples are not calibrated to any kSZ data. The FLAMINGO fiducial and feedback variants are external simulation products whose calibration is described, and the paper is explicit that fgas−8σ was calibrated to pre-eROSITA gas fractions shifted down by Nσ. The partial circularity is confined to the X-ray comparison: a model constructed to have lower gas fractions naturally matches a data set with lower gas fractions, so the eROSITA agreement does not independently confirm the X-ray part of the consensus claim. However, the kSZ comparison, which is the other pillar of the central claim, is genuinely independent, and the paper also discloses the high-mass LRG kSZ disagreement and the spec/photo pipeline inconsistency. The self-citations to McCarthy et al. (2025) are methodological and are re-tested in Appendix B, so they are not load-bearing circularity. Overall, the central conclusion has substantial independent grounding, but the X-ray agreement is partly forced by construction, giving a score of 3 rather than 0.
Assumptions & free parameters
free parameters (2)
- Minimum stellar mass cut (per kSZ sample) =
e.g., BGS, LRG M1, M2, LOWZ, CMASS (Tables 1, 2)
- Minimum halo mass cut (per eROSITA cluster bin) =
Tables 3
assumptions (3)
- domain assumption FLAMINGO simulations provide an accurate galaxy-halo connection (stellar mass-halo mass relation, satellite fractions)
- domain assumption The observed kSZ velocity reconstruction biases (r_v) are correctly transferred to simulated velocities
- domain assumption eROSITA gas mass measurements and weak-lensing-calibrated masses are unbiased at the claimed level
Cite this review
Pith. "Pith review of Joint X-ray, kinetic Sunyaev-Zeldovich, and weak lensing measurements: toward a consensus picture of efficient gas expulsion from groups and clusters." pith.science (2026). https://pith.science/paper/NCYZEK6L
@misc{pith2026250910455,
author = {Pith},
title = {Pith review of: Joint X-ray, kinetic Sunyaev-Zeldovich, and weak lensing measurements: toward a consensus picture of efficient gas expulsion from groups and clusters},
year = {2026},
howpublished = {\url{https://pith.science/paper/NCYZEK6L}},
note = {Machine review of arXiv:2509.10455}
}
abstract
There is no consensus on how baryon feedback shapes the underlying matter distribution from either simulations or observations. We confront the uncertain landscape by jointly analyzing new measurements of the gas distribution around groups and clusters -- DESI+ACT kinetic Sunyaev-Zel'dovich (kSZ) effect profiles and eROSITA X-ray gas masses -- with mean halo masses characterized by galaxy-galaxy lensing. Across a wide range of halo masses ($M_{500}=10^{13-14}M_\odot$) and redshifts ($0<z<1$), we find evidence of more efficient gas expulsion beyond several $R_{500}$ than predicted by most state-of-the-art simulations. A like-with-like comparison reveals all kSZ and X-ray observations are inconsistent with the fiducial 1 Gpc$^{3}$ hydrodynamical FLAMINGO simulation, which was calibrated to reproduce pre-eROSITA X-ray gas fractions: eROSITA X-ray gas fractions are $2\times$ lower than the simulation, and the kSZ measurements are combined $>8 \sigma$ discrepant. The FLAMINGO simulation variant with the most gas expulsion, and therefore the most suppression of the matter power spectrum relative to a dark matter only simulation, provides a good description of how much gas is expelled and how far it extends; the enhanced gas depletion is achieved by more powerful but less frequent AGN outbursts. Joint kSZ, X-ray, and lensing measurements form a consistent picture of gas expulsion beyond several $R_{500}$, implying a more suppressed matter power spectrum than predicted by most recent simulations. Complementary observables and next-generation simulations are critical to understanding the physical mechanism behind this extreme gas expulsion and mapping its impact on the large-scale matter distribution.
Figures
Figures from the paper (5 more)
Forward citations
Cited by 4 Pith papers
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Evidence for a thermal pressure deficit in galaxy groups from the tSZ effect and weak lensing
Stacked tSZ measurements around DESI LRGs show FLAMINGO simulations overpredict the thermal pressure of galaxy groups by about a factor of two, including the feedback variant that matches kSZ gas densities.
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Interpreting the stacked kinetic SZ effect I: velocity reconstruction and non-linear velocity effects
Non-linear velocity terms cancel in real-space linear reconstruction, but redshift-space distortions reintroduce a 10–20% small-scale suppression of the stacked kSZ signal.
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A new measurement of the FRB DM-galaxy cross correlation and a first joint analysis with the kinematic SZ effect
The FRB DM-galaxy cross-correlation is detected at 6.5 sigma and disfavors a no-feedback baryon distribution at about 9 sigma.
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What's Missing in AGN Feedback? Lessons learnt from Magneticum, IllustrisTNG and Simba
No current simulation simultaneously reproduces observed halo hot-gas fractions and local galaxy star-formation/quenching demographics; strong AGN feedback overquenches, weak feedback retains too much gas.
Reference graph
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